:toc:

== INTROS
all right i guess we can go ahead and
get started thank you all for joining us
for another sentence dojo
um we have with us several members of
the board of directors who will answer
all of your questions
if you would like to ask questions you
can do so either in the chat or in the q
a that's in the
section to the right of your screen
and
we will get started with some
introductions here
um
and uh this this uh session is recorded
and so
everything you say can and will be used
against you later on
so let's let's start with some
introductions um oh and pat has joined
us excellent and john john
so let's start with some introductions
here here
we have an outcome going on
yeah
so let's uh move around the screen here
backs

=== bex
hi i'm brian exobeard bax i am the red
hat liaison to the centos board and so
as such i actually speak on behalf of
red hat when i speak for the board or
speak at the board meetings and so i'm
the only member of the board who does
not represent themselves
i work for the rel business unit and
you'll learn more about me in the next
talk

=== alphacc
thomas
hi i'm tobas i'm working at cern i
joined
the board last year
i'm interested in everything around
distribution so
go ahead ask questions

=== dcavalca
david
hi i'm davide i'm a production engineer
at facebook
i within santos i chair the hyperscale
sig
i joined the board this year
and happy to answer any questions you
might have

=== josh
hey josh boyer
newly appointed
board member with davide uh i work on
rel in the linux engineering
organization


=== johnny
everybody goes through that right yeah i
hope so right so my name is johnny
hughes and i've been building and
signing centos packages since about 2003
um so
if you guys have any questions let me
know
and i work oh i work in internally
inside of red hat and i am on the uh cpe
team
the team that actually takes care
part of our job is to take care of the
infrastructure for centos as well as uh
the infrastructure and and the startup
of centos stream 89

=== jcpunk
and pad
hi i'm pat i joined the board about the
same time as tomas
i've been working in the rebuild space
for uh over a decade both uh
informally with the centos community and
uh directly on scientific linux
uh work with fedora on a couple things
here and there
i am always happy to chat with you about
free software projects
so as you've heard we have a wide range
of expertise here
please do
ask your questions

== Questions
and we we didn't really preload this
with a bunch of staged questions but uh
if uh if there are no questions i'll ask
the
directors to to ramble at length so
please please do ask any questions you
might have either in the chat or in the
q a tool

=== When will CS9 be available?
all right i will i will start then with
a question that i was asked on irc this
morning it's already been answered on
the mailing list but uh
when will centos stream nine be
available
do you want me to cover that one
i guess it depends on the definition are
yeah that's exactly where i was gonna go
with it um
so we have centos stream nine uh
production composers in place uh you can
find them
they are going to be going to the
mirrors very soon i believe i think we
actually have it on the centos mirror
network but we don't have um
like a centos repos definition in place
i know the team was working on that
either last week or this week but any
day now in terms of normal availability
that most people would think of

=== CS9 relnotes?
yeah on the stream nine front uh do we
have uh our release notes or some
documentation for things that we're
excited about
up that we can point people towards
no
not that i know
that's a good question though um
i'm not aware of us producing release
notes for stream
uh i would say at the point when real
nine beta is released we can certainly
leverage those but stream will have
already you know moved on towards what
we're doing to ga shouldn't be that much
different though considering it's a
major release
there was some talk of making the
documentation
public in a git repo somewhere so that
folks could contribute to it before it
was out varelle i don't know what's the
stage of that uh i said it was a triad
on centos docs on this as well
yeah i actually don't know the answer to
that question either
uh carl is is uh pointing out that we do
have a centaur stream release package
that has centos stream repos in it
and brian says we're still working with
the docs team

=== Toolbox ad
i'll give a personal answer to that is
i've been enjoying toolbox on fedora to
be able to manage my containers and it
will be available on el nine this will
be very exciting to to be able to run
containers um
easily with graphic applications and
things so if you didn't check out this
project yet i encourage you to to have a
look to to toolbox it's very very nice
project and it helps a lot if you're
desktop user and want to complete the
rise applications

=== t_functional for CS9, compose gating?
we have two questions in the chat and
i'm going to read this aloud for the
purpose of the recording the first one
is what's going to replace sig core t
functional for cs9 in particular i'm
interested in compose mirror content
gating will we be able to see test
status somewhere and contribute tests to
it
i'm also interested in this if anybody
knows the answer
we should have invited brian to join
this panel
um his answer for the recording is he
suggests focus on package level testing
uh through git lab right now
so i don't know that we have an answer
to the what is going to replace it um
but that is suggested approach is the
functional actually going away i thought
the plan was to keep it around and have
something else but
i'm not sure to be honest

==== centos governance explained
it's it's worth mentioning in this
context that um
the census project is governed in what's
known as a bicameral fashion in the
sense that the board of directors is
primarily responsible for the the
health of the project and the
functioning of the various parts and
that sigs are doing what they're
supposed to be doing
whereas technical leadership happens
throughout the project
um and there there are people who are
not on the board who are making
technical decisions
and uh those two things are there's
obviously a lot of overlap but those two
things are
separate in many senses

==== link to centos may dojo about stream ci state
anyway um
go ahead on the uh
testing a front i believe uh there's a
presentation at the may dojo on santos
stream ci state and future plans
um i i would try to give the presenter's
name but i'm certain to butcher it
but there was a good video on that at
the last uh dojo talking about what the
cia getting policies are headed towards

==== more on t_functional future
and i could talk a little bit about t
functional so basically that that was
something that we've been using for
quite a long time uh it's going to
continue to be alive as long as we have
certainly as long as we have centos 7
uh released because that's that's what
we use to do the release on syntax 7. um
as far as the stream
nine is concerned that's where we're
starting to roll in all the tests that
that the rel developers want to roll in
in order to uh you know in order to do
the testing and so
that ci is going to be significantly
bigger and better
have more tests and gating and all kinds
of other things in it that we don't have
in
t functional which is basically just
something that the community put
together uh and we update that the t
functional stuff when we updated it's
because people have
had a problem that they talked to us
about
and and helped us solve whatever problem
that was and then we rolled that into
our testing to make sure we don't do it
again so so that's basically from the
from the older versions of centos and
fixing problems that we saw
uh that we actually released uh and most
of those problems were things that
that we did in centos that weren't
actually in rail there were problems
that we created somehow
and then the t functional tests actually
go through and look at that stuff and
make sure that you know make sure that
the secure boot signature is correct and
a bunch of other different things that
that we
uh didn't get right
on our changing
and and most of those a lot of those
tests aren't really
a lot of those tests aren't really
relevant to stream because stream is
happening upstream of rail
and it and we're not having a problem
doing the builds the same way we did
when it was downstream
uh it's actually getting built uh
beforehand and actually getting built by
the the real team
uh they actually push the builds and do
the the
the the work on all of the packages
so it's a it's a different concept

=== RHEL 8.5 Beta vs CentOS Stream 8 vs CentOS Linux 8 final
we have a question from luna who says i
saw rel 8.5 beta was released a couple
of days ago will sent a stream eight
update to the stable version of that rel
version or is it nine only
is it nine that only will be supported
in the future
can i can i take this one really quickly
as a user point of view rather than
someone working at red hat so we had an
interesting thing is we had to debug a
problem with some intel cpus and
basically centos stream is the upstream
of
rail 8.5 so the kernel that you have in
stream now is the canon that would be
shipped with 8.5 so we could test
basically uh our intel cpu with stream
and it was working well it was not
working with 8.4 and so we are sure that
it'd be we're working in 8.5 so you have
to remember that stream is already if
you want to rail 8.5 at this stage
is it clear and maybe some people want
to add on that
yeah uh i'd add to that uh
stream uh eight is running to 2024. uh
the the support for stream eight isn't
going anywhere uh stream nine is where
the exciting things are kind of
happening for a lot of us here on the
board
because this is a new and exciting and
lively project but stream mate is going
to hang around until 2024. um it's it's
not going anywhere
so don't don't worry about
that disappearing on you that is
something that we feel very very
important
streamlight is going to be here 2024.
and as far as centos linux 8 is
concerned the downstream build
uh we are going to build centos linux
8.5 uh off based off of rail 8.5 that's
going to get built it's going to get
released
and then
depending on whether that happens before
or after the end of this year
uh it'll either be available for a long
period of time
uh you know if i don't know when 8.5
braille 8.5 is going to come out but
uh at december 31st
um that's the eol for centos linux eight
not centos stream eight which is as pat
said is going to be around for until
2024. uh centos linux 8 will still get
moved into the vault area so
vault.syntax.org we'll have
the final release version of centos
linux 8.5 and all of the zero day
updates that come out as part of of
uh the source code for for rel 8.5 all
of those updates that are zero day
updates and all of the ga release for
8.5 will go out
they will it will be on
vaultlessness.org and then it won't get
any more updates after that
so
basically 8.5
on ga day
uh and any updates that actually
physically happen before
december 31st of this year will get
rolled in to what we have is 8.5 or
centos 8 linux
and nothing after that
besides the zero day updates if the
for some reason the rel 8.5 gets delayed
so that that's what will be in the vault
now we don't recommend
that you actually use that in production
after updates stop happening because
there's going to be security issues in
that
you know in that 8.5 area once red hat
is producing
uh
red linux 8 updates for security that
we're no longer rolling into a
downstream centos linux 8.
so we don't recommend that you use that
in fact you should you probably
shouldn't be using it right now
it's only two months until it goes away
if you haven't already made plans to
move off of centos 8 linux
you're way behind so you need to be
doing something to to plan on the fact
that it's not going to be here
uh after
december

=== Modularity in CS9
we've got a few more questions um
first we have an anonymous question what
is the state of modularity incentive
stream nine
i i can take that one um
will continue to exist in stream nine
and real nine uh the usage of it is a
little bit reduced in scope based on
what you saw in rail eight perhaps i
think in stream nine composes today we
have a one or two modules both related
to our container tooling
i actually expect that to go away before
row 9ga because we're doing some
repackaging of how we're doing those
tools
but then we'll have modules introduced
in later versions of a rel and they'll
materialize and stream before they show
up there
Laughter
well it's a start that's right uh brian
points out and this is actually really
something
that's
good to highlight
uh we were able to actually do this
modular development and stream and and
get it in there and prove that it's
actually working including a slight
change in the module format uh to help
validate that like what we would like to
do with modules long term will actually
work
so stream continues to pay dividends on
what we're trying to accomplish there
a stream has a lot of potential but it
is also a scary hydra but it also can
like you can feed it a lot it has
multiple heads

=== Where can I help?
mike asks what are some areas of the
sentence project that you think could
use the most help or work
well as we move forward i think that the
sigs are going to be the most important
community part of centos stream
right because
centaur stream is is the internal
development for rel
obviously community input to that's
going to be important to fix things and
to fix problems and and for feedback
but also
uh special interest group content is
going to be additive to that right so if
there's something that you want to get
added
to
allow the community to use it
then uh the sig is the perfect way to
make that happen
and then there'll be a different there's
a whole obviously there's a whole
different process for getting things in
the row we're not talking about putting
things into row but we are talking about
getting things
on centos mirrors and available to the
public
through
centos stream in a sig process
and if that stuff is good and if and if
you guys want to work and get that stuff
into real red hat will have a way to
make that kind of thing those kind of
things happen right they have they have
partners and things to make make that
sort of stuff happen
but uh just getting it out in the
community uh open sourcing your code
getting your code worked on sigs are
definitely
where i see
uh the the biggest impact
in moving forward with centos
i personally love to see more people
start engaging directly with santos on
gitlab i think for stream we have a
really good system and a really good
opportunity there where people can
directly engage with the maintainers and
send prs if they have specific things
they would like to see changing in
packages uh and i don't think folks
quite realize right now
that that is actually a thing like i was
mentioning before the hallway track that
we had a really good experience recently
getting a number of fixes merged in nine
through the pipeline and i would love to
see more people take advantage of that
also because i think the more people use
this the more the maintainers become
familiar with the process and the easier
it gets
yeah i will definitely uh echo that
i would love to see some folks engaged
with stream as sort of
like particularly screen9 for their
workflows
what do you need this os to do
install it does it do that by default if
not should it do that by default if it
shouldn't do that by default is there
some tooling we can build to make it
easier to make that change over
i'd love to see people really look at
what they're running the system
workloads are
figure out how we can make stream adapt
to those with as little effort as
possible so that it can actually do what
you need it to do
in a clear and straightforward manner
as those changes are going to stick
around if they're going to move into rel
as uh devito was mentioning so we can
get a clear defined make the system do
what you want it to do the way you want
it to do it process
that then lands in the fully supported
product so if you can't run stream you
can actually get these same advantages
there
and so i'm really seeing a lot of
interesting workflow options available
where you can influence
how the os behaves
but we have to get on record as to how
we want it to behave

==== Docs/wiki cleanup
i have a a slightly different answer
sentence has long been a more user user
focused community than than developer
focused
as such
a great place to get involved is with
the documentation the wiki has been
accreting garbage for 15 years
needs some folks to step up to clean
that up make it accurate and up-to-date
uh clean out the stuff that is no longer
relevant there's a lot of that i've been
working on it over the past couple years
but i'm not the expert that most of you
are
and that's that's a place where we could
really use a lot of help
additional to that we have the centos
forums and
all of the sort of uh
universe of of social media sites like
the facebook site the mailing lists
where where people come to ask questions
and those questions often go unanswered
these are places where your expertise
can be really valuable to the community
and make centers more useful for
everybody with with your expertise

==== sigs.centos.org ad
and on the subject of documentation uh
let me also plug the server the fabian
put together for six where six can now
put up static sites with their own
documentation on sixthosendos.org
uh and we started using that for
hyperscale and it's really really nice
because we were looking for a place to
start doing more like user-facing
documentation because
i think the wiki is a bit of a
discoverability problem partly because
as you mentioned a lot of the content
isn't the greatest and partly because
the format i think some users might find
it a bit odd for documentation and
having like a curated static site is
really helpful there
and one more point is as well if you
don't speak only english we always
welcome contribution in different
languages

=== HW vendors and Stream
the next question is from robbie who
asks some major hardware vendors have
been less than enthusiastic regarding
the support of centos stream does the
centers project or the board have any
insight on this is there anything the
community can do to help
i would say engaging with the vendors
that you have a relationship with and
both helping them understand what stream
is and trying to help them get on board
is definitely useful here uh in my
experience there is still a lot of
confusion sometimes around stream i
definitely had to have the talk of like
no santos is not gone
this is still a thing and like no stream
isn't changing every day with more than
one vendor
so definitely that will help
and i suspect going forward as these
messages start sinking and there's more
and more vendors that start building
against stream this will become easier
yeah really the only thing that i see in
stream that is any kind of problem
for for anybody is is is kernels
as as we don't have the same kind of abi
stuff that they have in release type
kernels but
the release type kernels are getting
rolled into eight
right now
right so
they're optional installs
but they're not
the default install because they have a
lower version right but those things are
available so you could
uh because we need to test those as well
right so so you could
have
some of the other kernels if you wanted
them also
uh if the issue happens to be modules or
something like that there's a sig for
for kernel modules
and the vendor could also
start something that that
that uh
they use a kernel that they build
themselves if that's their sticking
point
so so and that's the only thing that i
see that's in any way
a problem in stream is is is
the fact that some of the kernel abis
move ahead
uh during the during the period
right
that's easily addressable if somebody
wants to address it if somebody in the
community wants to address it
other than that it's perfect i mean i've
been using nothing but stream
for my main workstation
since we started the project and i've
had zero problems with it uh for i don't
a year
i mean yeah and on the user's land front
i've been running all sorts of various
tests and the progressions against
things in user space
i've found i don't know maybe a dozen
additional apis that are in stream that
are not in rel
uh when you compare that to the roughly
1 million blinkable objects
12 is not that many
and generally speaking
they're new exciting features that you
have to specifically opt into
for the userland stuff
i really haven't found anything that
doesn't run on stream or that runs on
stream that doesn't run on a rel uh
they're just
they're probably like they logically can
exist but i haven't found them
so yeah basically if somebody converted
your machine if somebody converted your
linux machine
over the stream
you would be hard-pressed to tell the
difference unless you did a bunch of
research to figure it out i think i
think that's the the moral of pat's
story right there
i don't actually think you'd be that
hard pressed
but
uh i mean the nvidia module uh pops to
mind like that's going to be a challenge
that we know um
that aside i guess when i read the
question from robbie it was a great
question but as the rel guy that does
this day in a day out
uh i read maybe more into it than it was
intended because talking about a major
hardware vendor supporting stream like
what does support mean is one question
the initial takeaway i had was
if the major hardware vendor is
intending for their hardware to be
supported in rel then it will naturally
have to go through stream to begin with
so engaging
our oem partners our isv partners that's
all activity that we're doing
on the rail side
through internal mechanisms
hopefully like pat and johnny have said
things are working but the support thing
is uh that raised some some eyebrows for
me like what does that mean you know
what does it look like and robby we can
talk through chat or whatever and cover
that if you need to
yeah for what is worth one thing i've
seen a few times is uh a lot of time
people
when they support them in qualification
so they will want to use a product from
a vendor and the vendor says this works
on x and if it breaks on x you can send
us a ticket and we'll fix it
one challenge i've seen there for stream
is because stream doesn't have versions
it's hard for the vendor to say this is
qualified on stream because stream is
a moving target to some extent
on
with my facebook hat on one thing we
have tried and has worked uh is telling
people okay
given that we have composers qualify
these compose
and let's use that as the thing you have
qualified
and we we had better luck with that
approach and i think effectively
composers are the versions for stream um
of course this might not necessarily
work for all cases but that is an option
here
and at some point in my san hat we have
the same uh approach basically and uh
you alex is around i think it's a chat
if you want to discuss about what was
done around stream uh in terms of how we
distribute it
so let me know i will connect people
together
the next question that we have if
there's no more comments from the board
um speak up now if you have any uh the
next question oh go ahead i'm sorry i
was just gonna say obviously the
versions of packages in stream is
different i'm not saying that it's
exactly the same i'm saying from a
function i was just saying from a
functionality standpoint if you weren't
actually looking at versions or looking
for qualifications which
vendors need in order to to certify
things
i was just saying from the from the
standpoint of you running things and
doing things on your machine that it
functionally
works
just works right but it's not going to
be
obviously not going to be the same
versioning

=== Default module stream is unsupported upstream e.g. PHP
the next question that we have is
rel and center stream 8 has a ton of
modules default to unsupported content
right now php etc
can we see default streams change to
supported content in the future so
people get the right stuff
we have no plans to do that no
it is i don't want to trivialize the the
question because it is actually a
problem that we continue to iterate on
and try to figure out how best to
address on the rel side of things
um but at the moment we have no plans to
change the defaults
so i just wanted to be clear
is the point that is does it mean like
the version of psp that we ship is
unsupported upstream and absolutely must
move on is that what this is about uh no
i i understood the question to mean uh
in some cases
we ship a module with a default stream
so if you type yum install whatever that
thing is it will install that version
and because of the way we have modules
or application streams more in general
because it modules a packaging type it's
not the concept that we're really
talking about those have a shorter life
cycle than the full rail release and
some of them are already out of support
okay but you can still use alternate
streams to get other versions that are
still under support okay
yeah that's particularly complicated in
database land where you have actual
binary blobs on the disk that are your
table layouts
and you don't want
to get like surprised you've got a new
version of postgres well that's
fantastic it's faster it's better
supported it'll do more things
except the more things that it does are
not read your database tables
and uh that's
yeah that's
it's complicated to get people the new
bright chinese secured stuff and also
not completely trash their production
boxes
that's right and i will say this
davide asked earlier about default
modules in in real
this is one of the lessons that we've
we've learned
and is something we're trying to take
into account for future versions so

=== Migrating from CL8 to CS8
we have another question in the q a
if you have asked questions in the chat
they have scrolled away and i've lost
track of them so if you have questions
that have not been answered yet please
put them in the q a tab or they will get
neglected the next question is do you
think there will be a point where
migrating from a centus linux 8 system
to a census stream 8 system will start
breaking
that shouldn't happen like it should
just work
i mean it's hard to speak in absolutes
i can't really think of
within eight i can't really think of
scenarios where this would be a problem
now if you try to do an update in place
from say centos linux to stream nine
two years from now well that's not
supported but also yeah i would suspect
that would not be as easy but for eight
i would wager it will probably be okay
i yeah again it's hard to it's hard to
say for you know
without looking at specific examples of
of packages that things get moved to
right you you can't say for sure that
that's going to be the case but it
should be the case because it should be
fine because red hat's not going to
publish something that totally breaks
moving from from
rel 8.4 to rel nine or to rel 8.6
they're they're not going to put
anything in there that breaks that right
they have people moving all the time
from one version to another
and they have
z streams that they support for periods
of time
uh and then people have to move off of
that during the the life cycle
so i doubt very of rel so i doubt very
seriously that
that that during the rail eight process
there's going to be something that that
breaks
an upgrade from rail 8.0 to rail 8.9 for
example i don't think that's gonna break
the same thing should be true for stream
from from that standpoint
yeah i mean i i think i agree with all
of you i
i'm perhaps a little bit more
conservative and i would say if you're
planning to do that you know
eight five goes out uh you're on centos
linux a5 and then a year goes by and you
wanna update the stream
please try do it on a vm perhaps first
right get some data because if if that
migration fails we want to know about it
so we can fix it right um but don't do
it blindly
yeah that goes for every migration by
the way
yeah for anything right
i mean
the world story is make sure you don't
always have good backups because you
never know when your system is going
through a hard drive so
a good backup is always a wonderful
thing to have


=== dnf system upgrade 9 -> 10 ?
mike asks do you think users would be
able to perform
dnf system upgrade for stream nine to
stream ten
he's not expecting this for eight to
nine
so i wrote this in the chat if someone's
interested in building this and helping
make this a thing
we would definitely be happy to see that
this is one of those things that is
technically possible because fedora does
but someone needs to actually test it
out five bucks for what doesn't work 50
bugs and then
do the upkeep to keep this working in
the long term which is
i suspect a non-trivial amount of work
but if someone wants to do this or spin
up a seeker on this that would
definitely be appreciated
yes and we we had the same question for
seven to eight and we asked the same we
said we need people to try to do it and
we need help and unfortunately it didn't
happen so if you're really interested
it's a good time to to to try to start
to do something about it but we need
people to show up and to
to look at what can be done
and it's certainly non-trivial right for
it's hard enough to do for fedora and
that's like a six month window right
of updated package versions and when you
do it for for
for centos or rel you're talking about a
five year minimum
uh time frame right a three year to five
year time frame so that's like
uh updating a fedora release to like a
release that's that's uh six or seven
versions higher than the one you're on
right now which is significantly
different than doing a
one to the next release
packages don't work data doesn't work uh
the configurations don't continue to
work across that vert that big of a
version of uh changing packages
there's a like
i would love to see a migration path
will take you from screen mate to stream
nine but as i mentioned
earlier the
the key there is
for things that are written after disk
what do you do with database devices how
do you read the old data files that are
written in the
format that it recognizes how do you uh
migrate your configurations for things
like
rabbitmq where
it's written in erlang now and then they
moved it to an ii
syntax and so we're going to bring down
your entire
message bus because
you've got a new package and that's
great
and so getting those kinds of
configuration
changes where the actual syntax of the
file has changed
on you can be very
difficult uh i look sort of
quickly so if you look at the move from
six
to seven okay well we had the user
move or the stuff and didn't move to
user if your
partitions aren't big enough you're
upgrading
well which module stream do we
pick to move you into for apache
and so as we sort of look some
point into the crystal ball for eight to
nine well
which module streams do you pick what
and you're going from uh
as we mentioned the chat there you're
going from an unsub supported php module
stream that has reached
life well do we leave that on your box
so that your web server still works
because i feel like the expected result
is
well no give me the security patch
the expect result is also well my app
should still work
and uh
those are really opposed options
but your
your audio is a bit bad five seven
your audio
your audio is not great uh i don't know
if you can do something you are a bit
too far from the mic i don't know okay
i can uh try and move to a different
microphone i was
getting the echo earlier and i switched
to this headphone mic that's kind of
garbagey
yeah you're coming through a really
chocolate it sounds like it's network
rather than microphone maybe a browser
reload helps sometimes
okay
yeah it's
the ideas of micro
are tricky but i'd love to see some work
and basically a special interest group
this is another example of where a
special interest group would be great
for for this kind of thing
if somebody wanted to do that and wanted
to have a special interest group that
allowed uh migration of one versus the
stream to the next we would certainly
consider that
uh uh you know on the board and see it
by getting it approved and get people
working on it but that's something that
is difficult
and we certainly don't have time to
to do that as part of the normal
uh main maintenance of centos stream
in general right
and i don't know about you guys i used
to do this for a living as an
administrator and i would never actually
upgrade any machine in place that had
anything in production on it right it
would always be on a new machine
and i'd make sure all my data was
working in the new place before i did a
conversion um
i i don't know that there's really
a good case for doing
major
upgrades in place
machines that are that are server based
maybe work stations or machines that you
use to run containers but not
normal uh
applications because of the uh
the difficulty of moving
data and configurations between
different versions
yeah i think from workstations this will
be particularly valuable i agree for
servers we have the same approach we
knew can pave because it's a lot it's a
lot easier
but i think for people that want to run
stream
as they were stationed because it
provides them an environment that's more
stable than fedora for example uh
definitely the ability to have in place
update to be really valuable because
people don't want to reimage the laptop
every three years or so

=== container tools
we have a question from bala regarding
container tools how long between a dev
release to a center stream release for
example podman
0 was released this week
when will it when will it be available
in center stream
as far as where the real guy's going to
actually start looking at
it right that's not something that the
centos true
green
team has anything to do with
yeah and i think having an answer you
know at a higher level might be helpful
i mean this particular package no i
don't think we can answer that but but
understanding how the rel development
process works
i can speak to that that one's actually
pretty easy so
when a particular version of a package
or update will land in stream is
entirely dependent on the rail
development process so container tools
has their own road map that they do for
rail customers i actually don't know if
it's public or not i can try to find
that out but
essentially the plans there are they
kind of rev it much faster than the rest
of rel
and they have multiple streams at least
in stream nine stream mate they're kind
of revisiting how they're how they're
doing this
an upstream release into when it gets
into rel sometimes it will be never
sometimes it will be in the next live
stream and then we would see it land in
centos stream first
and sometimes we skip upstream releases
right depending on what the product
roadmap looks

=== SIGs CS8/9 overlap
like marcin asks will sigs continue to
produce packages for sento stream 8
after the centos stream 9 release
overlap of content production for main
repos is obvious but for sigs not so
much
i can take this one so it obviously
depends on the sig uh i can say that for
hyperscale uh we are currently building
for 8s and we start the building for 9s
and we'll continue doing 9 when when we
can actually release packages uh
i would expect we will keep everything
up for eight until the eol for eight for
stream eight i mean
my hunch is that you will probably
continue seeing a decent flow of
packages in for eight for the next
couple of years
uh after that i would expect it will
probably taper out because most of the
developers and most of the work will
have moved on to nine but if someone
wants to continue doing bills for eight
there's nothing stopping us for it and
if somebody in the community is
particularly interested in a specific
package
um i think we could definitely try to
keep that actively built for eight
um going forward um but then everything
is gonna have different policies on this
i think
another possible answer
it's the same answer but stated
differently if this is something that
you care about then come make it happen
you know step up and be part of the
solution and that
all of our sigs are very welcoming to
people that that want to come and and
help out and so if
if the sig does not have
the resources to continue a stream eight
build and you want that to happen then
make it happen
in doubt always create a bugzilla and uh
worst case
you will be told no but at least you
tried
yeah and i think honestly for
at least from what i've seen the the bar
for like oh we need this package built
we didn't say hyperscale because like i
don't know we need this version of crap
updated because as a fix it is not a ton
of work
uh so like if someone asks nicely
we will probably do it if someone wants
to contribute the work that is even
better of course

=== Board meeting ad
we have time for
i don't know one or two more questions
if there are any
i'll take this moment to remind everyone
that board of directors meetings are now
open
to anyone that's on the census develop
mailing list and wishes to join them the
when the announcement goes out for the
board of directors meeting there will be
information in there about how you can
request an invite to the meeting
we don't just post the link to the
meeting live online because that leads
to spammers showing up and doing
unsavory things but uh it is open to
anyone who requests that the board of
directors meeting will be held on
october the 13th
at
200 utc
i just sent the email to centos devil i
was like by one day sorry but it should
be it should be in so we are still
building the agenda for the next one but
feel free to bring subjects if you want

=== RHEL buildroots for SIGs
i think there's a few more questions
things yeah i just saw one come in
um and this is this is a good one what
is the status of rel build roots for
cigs and there is a ticket about this
number four hundred
and that might actually be a question
brian stinson might know something else
yeah that seems like an infrastructure
sig uh question
yeah to be honest i don't have feedback
on that i can't reply
yeah i saw them
on the ticket that we were fine with
doing it but i don't know where things
are at
yeah for the recording brian said in
chat that they're working on it and then
they have to change some of the ways
that we consume
content in the infrastructure space

=== OUTRO
whoever anonymous is they have very good
questions
true story those are some really great
i think we didn't reply to martha in
question did we
the second one
will sig continue to produce package for
c8
we talked about that okay sorry i
thought it was
another kind of question okay
all right well we are almost out of time
so if you have a question here's your
your last chance

==== container tools part 2
the answer to that pod man question is
uh i'm actually releasing that today so
um it was in the it was in the set of
packages that we just got
into stream eight
and it's already being tested in qa
but that has everything to do when the
real team actually released the
code and nothing to do with uh you know
us deciding to put it in there or not

==== Thank Yous
well uh thank you for the uh the
directors who have been here to answer
your questions
um we're going to take a
short break now before the next session
in the next session uh
becks will be talking about what red hat
wants
which has been an
ongoing question since the center's
group were brought on at red hat in 2014
and bex will have all of the answers to
that in about 10 minutes
so thank you all for your wonderful
questions rich i hope you brought your
shadow puppets
thanks for your questions and thanks for
the board participation here
thank you
thanks everybody
take care
